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Date: 03 Feb 2009 23:10:40
From: Irish Mike
Subject: This is why I don't trust Obama
Some RGPers say I "hate" Obama. That's not true. I do not hate Obama, I
just don't trust him. And the $ 885 billion ($ one trillion plus with
interest) "stimulus" bill he and the Democrats are trying to shove down the
tax payer's throats is one of the reasons. America is in financial crisis
and we desperately need some thing to turn this economy around and get us
back on track. Forgetting all disagreements on what really caused the
financial mess, this is the time to put partisan politics and social
engineering aside and really do some thing to help the American people.
What do the Democrats do? They jam a disgraceful $ 885 billion pork barrel
spending bill through congress that contains every ear mark and pet spending
project they can think of. Less than 25% of it will go toward job creation
and most of it won't even reach the economy for two or three years. To
their credit, all 177 congressional Republicans and 11 Democrats voted
against it. So now this $ 885 billion welfare, entitlement and grow big
federal government spending monstrosity slithers in to the Senate.

Senate Republicans stripped out the pork barrel spending and created an
alternative economic stimulus program that will jump start the economy,
create new jobs and do it for $445 billion, which is half the cost of the
Democrat plan.

"WASHINGTON (Reuters) - U.S. Senate Republicans on Tuesday offered their
own, cheaper economic stimulus plans focused on tax cuts, pushing back
against a nearly $900 billion Democratic plan they say encourages too much
new spending.

"The American people are beginning to figure out what this package is, that
it's not a stimulus package -- it's a spending package," said Sen. John
McCain, an Arizona Republican who lost to Obama in the 2008 presidential
election.

Senators worked throughout the day to find a bipartisan deal. McCain and
four other Republicans unveiled their ideas priced at $445 billion, half the
cost of Democratic version which started the day at $885 billion.

It centered on cutting in half a 6.2 percent payroll tax on employees,
cutting the corporate tax rate to 25 percent from 35 percent and lowering
the bottom two income tax brackets to 10 percent and 5 percent, all for one
year.

McCain and Sens. Lindsey Graham of South Carolina, John Thune of South
Dakota, Richard Burr of North Carolina and Mel Martinez of Florida also
proposed $11 billion to help prevent home foreclosures and $65 billion in
state grants to build and repair bridges and roads."

Now the following are some examples of the non-job creating, non-economic
stimulus spending that is included in the Democrat's $885 billion bill.
Keep in mind that the purpose of the bill is to be a temporary, targeted
stimulus to immediately create jobs and jump start the economy. It was not
supposed to be loaded with welfare, entitlement, give away and social
engineering spending. There are already multiple government agencies and
spending bills to address those issues.

"(CNN) -- On Monday, Congressional Republican leaders put out a list of what
they call wasteful provisions in the Senate version of the nearly $900
billion stimulus bill that is being debated:

$2 billion earmark to re-start FutureGen, a near-zero emissions coal power
plant in Illinois that the Department of Energy defunded last year because
it said the project was inefficient.

. A $246 million tax break for Hollywood movie producers to buy motion
picture film.

. $650 million for the digital television converter box coupon program.

. $88 million for the Coast Guard to design a new polar icebreaker (arctic
ship).

. $448 million for constructing the Department of Homeland Security
headquarters.

. $248 million for furniture at the new Homeland Security headquarters.

. $600 million to buy hybrid vehicles for federal employees.

. $400 million for the Centers for Disease Control to screen and prevent
STD's.

. $1.4 billion for rural waste disposal programs.

. $125 million for the Washington sewer system.

. $150 million for Smithsonian museum facilities.

. $1 billion for the 2010 Census, which has a projected cost overrun of $3
billion.

. $75 million for "smoking cessation activities."

. $200 million for public computer centers at community colleges.

. $75 million for salaries of employees at the FBI.

. $25 million for tribal alcohol and substance abuse reduction.

. $500 million for flood reduction projects on the Mississippi River.

. $10 million to inspect canals in urban areas.

. $6 billion to turn federal buildings into "green" buildings.

. $500 million for state and local fire stations.

. $650 million for wildland fire management on forest service lands.

. $1.2 billion for "youth activities," including youth summer job programs.

. $88 million for renovating the headquarters of the Public Health Service.

. $412 million for CDC buildings and property.

. $500 million for building and repairing National Institutes of Health
facilities in Bethesda, Maryland.

. $160 million for "paid volunteers" at the Corporation for National and
Community Service.

. $5.5 million for "energy efficiency initiatives" at the Department of
Veterans Affairs National Cemetery Administration.

. $850 million for Amtrak.

. $100 million for reducing the hazard of lead-based paint.

. $75 million to construct a "security training" facility for State
Department Security officers when they can be trained at existing facilities
of other agencies.

. $110 million to the Farm Service Agency to upgrade computer systems.

. $200 million in funding for the lease of alternative energy vehicles for
use on military installations. "



And that list doesn't even include the $400 million for global warming
research or the tens of millions that will go to ACORN, which is currently
charged with voter fraud in 13 states. As I said, I don't hate Obama, I
just don't trust him.

Irish Mike






 
Date: 05 Feb 2009 00:53:04
From: Tad Perry
Subject: Re: This is why I don't trust Obama
I don't trust him either, as you know, because he's just not from trustable
stock. I'll be as simple with the connections as possible so the slow people
get it: Blagoyevich knows Rezko knows Obama, and their all of the same ilk.
The good news is that Obama's ego is so big that he *just has to be* the
Super Hero who rescued us at the last minute.

tvp




  
Date: 05 Feb 2009 05:21:20
From: Irish Mike
Subject: Re: This is why I don't trust Obama

"Tad Perry" <tadperry@comcast.net > wrote in message
news:gme9eo$6op$1@news.motzarella.org...
>I don't trust him either, as you know, because he's just not from trustable
> stock. I'll be as simple with the connections as possible so the slow
> people
> get it: Blagoyevich knows Rezko knows Obama, and their all of the same
> ilk.
> The good news is that Obama's ego is so big that he *just has to be* the
> Super Hero who rescued us at the last minute.
>
> tvp

You don't need to worry about Obama's ego - he's got that in spades (no pun
intended). It's his judgment that's the problem:

Twenty years kissing the ass of a racist, anti-American hate monger like
Jeremiah Wright.
Saying he could never disown the bastard - then doing it a couple of weeks
later.
Entering in to sleazy loan deals with Tony Rezko.
Knowingly dealing with murderer and terrorist William Ayers.
Lying about discussing his vacant senate seat with Blago.
Being an arm twister for ACORN and playing the race card on any bank that
wouldn't make high risk subprime loans.
Appointing a crook as secretary of commerce - who had to withdraw.
Appointing a repeat tax cheat as secretary of the treasury.
Appointing a repeat tax cheat as secretary of health and human services -
who had to withdraw.
Appointing a tax cheat as budget performance manager - who had to withdraw.
Trying to jam a $900 billion welfare, entitlement and social engineering
spending bill down tax payer's throats.
Appointing a left wing liberal to destroy the CIA and handcuff America's
intelligence gathering capability.
Agreeing to meet with the leaders of terrorist states without
pre-conditions.
Closing Gitmo with no plan for handling existing or future captured
terrorists.
Eliminating enchanced interogration techniques and announcing it to our
enemies.

Irish Mike




 
Date: 04 Feb 2009 19:14:15
From: dontbelikemike
Subject: Re: This is why I don't trust Obama
On Tue, 3 Feb 2009 23:10:40 -0500, "Irish Mike"
<mjostar@ameritech.net > wrote:

>Forgetting all disagreements on what really caused the
>financial mess


Hmmmm...


 
Date: 04 Feb 2009 13:38:28
From: Stephen Jacobs
Subject: Re: This is why I don't trust Obama

"Irish Mike" <mjostar@ameritech.net > wrote in message
news:0E8il.10181$pr6.8011@flpi149.ffdc.sbc.com...
>

And of course, to pick examples of convenience, dropping the corporate
income tax rate for three years will get money moving in the economy faster
than starting construction of a new icebreaker will, right?

By definition, Mike, economic stimulus means putting out money. Spend it,
lend it or give it, but put it out. Not collecting it hardly ever works as
fast, and almost never has a "multiplier effect." Now, the slant on
economics favored by The New Right belittles the multiplier effect--we're
seeing it so clearly now, though, that its practical importance is
undeniable. All those complaints about banks just sitting on bailout
money?--that's about multipliers. The conservative economists may be
correct that a few months down the road "high" and "low" multiplier money
wind up doing the same thing (notice that I say "may be;" I personally think
the advantage lasts longer), but we clearly need a fast pop in consumer
confidence. And what's making consumers un-confident? Largely, the fear
that they will soon lose their jobs and have to burn through a large
fraction of their backup resources before they are earning again. Ordinary
new business investment (which tax cuts purport to encourage) has at least a
6-month lead time before anybody new gets hired. A government order to a
company quickly diminishes the threat of layoffs, and keeps people spending.




  
Date: 04 Feb 2009 11:57:26
From: RazzO
Subject: Re: This is why I don't trust Obama
Stephen, have you seen this yet (related to terror)?

http://cryptogon.com/?p=6683


On Feb 4 2009 10:38 AM, Stephen Jacobs wrote:

> And of course, to pick examples of convenience, dropping the corporate
> income tax rate for three years will get money moving in the economy faster
> than starting construction of a new icebreaker will, right?
>
> By definition, Mike, economic stimulus means putting out money. Spend it,
> lend it or give it, but put it out. Not collecting it hardly ever works as
> fast, and almost never has a "multiplier effect." Now, the slant on
> economics favored by The New Right belittles the multiplier effect--we're


RazzO

(...)

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Date: 04 Feb 2009 12:03:44
From: ChrisRobin
Subject: Re: This is why I don't trust Obama
On Feb 4 2009 1:38 PM, Stephen Jacobs wrote:

> "Irish Mike" <mjostar@ameritech.net> wrote in message
> news:0E8il.10181$pr6.8011@flpi149.ffdc.sbc.com...
> >
>
> And of course, to pick examples of convenience, dropping the corporate
> income tax rate for three years will get money moving in the economy faster
> than starting construction of a new icebreaker will, right?
>
> By definition, Mike, economic stimulus means putting out money. Spend it,
> lend it or give it, but put it out. Not collecting it hardly ever works as
> fast, and almost never has a "multiplier effect." Now, the slant on
> economics favored by The New Right belittles the multiplier effect--we're
> seeing it so clearly now, though, that its practical importance is
> undeniable. All those complaints about banks just sitting on bailout
> money?--that's about multipliers. The conservative economists may be
> correct that a few months down the road "high" and "low" multiplier money
> wind up doing the same thing (notice that I say "may be;" I personally think
> the advantage lasts longer), but we clearly need a fast pop in consumer
> confidence. And what's making consumers un-confident? Largely, the fear
> that they will soon lose their jobs and have to burn through a large
> fraction of their backup resources before they are earning again. Ordinary
> new business investment (which tax cuts purport to encourage) has at least a
> 6-month lead time before anybody new gets hired. A government order to a
> company quickly diminishes the threat of layoffs, and keeps people spending.

I agree with most of this, except the part about banks not loaning money
because of the "multiplier effect." They're not loaning because they're
broke (don't have the reserves required by law to loan, even after
receiving bailout money), and they're worried that the institutions to
which they'd loan are insolvent. Because many of the banks' assets are
"off-books" (mainly derivatives and the like), no one knows the true
financial condition of any other institution. That's also why they refuse
to set prices for their toxic mortgage assets – were their true value
known (or reset), the financial system would collapse overnight.

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Date: 04 Feb 2009 20:08:25
From: Stephen Jacobs
Subject: Re: This is why I don't trust Obama

"ChrisRobin" <a9dbf1e@webnntp.invalid > wrote in message
news:0u8p56xl76.ln2@recgroups.com...
> On Feb 4 2009 1:38 PM, Stephen Jacobs wrote:
>
>> All those complaints about banks just sitting on bailout
>> money?--that's about multipliers.

>
> I agree with most of this, except the part about banks not loaning money
> because of the "multiplier effect."

No no no. I didn't [mean to] say that banks aren't lending because of the
multiplier effect, I said [or meant] that the reason people object to banks
not lending is that this gives the money used to prop them up a low
multiplier...and it's being noticed.




    
Date: 05 Feb 2009 09:40:27
From: ChrisRobin
Subject: Re: This is why I don't trust Obama
On Feb 4 2009 8:08 PM, Stephen Jacobs wrote:

> "ChrisRobin" <a9dbf1e@webnntp.invalid> wrote in message
> news:0u8p56xl76.ln2@recgroups.com...
> > On Feb 4 2009 1:38 PM, Stephen Jacobs wrote:
> >
> >> All those complaints about banks just sitting on bailout
> >> money?--that's about multipliers.
>
> >
> > I agree with most of this, except the part about banks not loaning money
> > because of the "multiplier effect."
>
> No no no. I didn't [mean to] say that banks aren't lending because of the
> multiplier effect, I said [or meant] that the reason people object to banks
> not lending is that this gives the money used to prop them up a low
> multiplier...and it's being noticed.

I just re-read what you wrote and clearly I misinterpreted what you said.
Sorry!

_______________________________________________________________________ 
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Date: 03 Feb 2009 21:05:24
From: Porsche_Dan
Subject: Re: This is why I don't trust Obama
Name one Politician that you trust?

GWB? McCain? How about your messiah RushL?

Name one Politician that you would trust with your pension, 401k, or
whatever life line you have.

So when you say you don't trust Obama why should anybody give a rats ass?

I happen to agree with you on the stimulus package but your phraseology is
ignorant.







On Feb 3 2009 8:10 PM, Irish Mike wrote:

> Some RGPers say I "hate" Obama. That's not true. I do not hate Obama, I
> just don't trust him. And the $ 885 billion ($ one trillion plus with
> interest) "stimulus" bill he and the Democrats are trying to shove down the
> tax payer's throats is one of the reasons. America is in financial crisis
> and we desperately need some thing to turn this economy around and get us
> back on track. Forgetting all disagreements on what really caused the
> financial mess, this is the time to put partisan politics and social
> engineering aside and really do some thing to help the American people.
> What do the Democrats do? They jam a disgraceful $ 885 billion pork barrel
> spending bill through congress that contains every ear mark and pet spending
> project they can think of. Less than 25% of it will go toward job creation
> and most of it won't even reach the economy for two or three years. To
> their credit, all 177 congressional Republicans and 11 Democrats voted
> against it. So now this $ 885 billion welfare, entitlement and grow big
> federal government spending monstrosity slithers in to the Senate.
>
> Senate Republicans stripped out the pork barrel spending and created an
> alternative economic stimulus program that will jump start the economy,
> create new jobs and do it for $445 billion, which is half the cost of the
> Democrat plan.
>
> "WASHINGTON (Reuters) - U.S. Senate Republicans on Tuesday offered their
> own, cheaper economic stimulus plans focused on tax cuts, pushing back
> against a nearly $900 billion Democratic plan they say encourages too much
> new spending.
>
> "The American people are beginning to figure out what this package is, that
> it's not a stimulus package -- it's a spending package," said Sen. John
> McCain, an Arizona Republican who lost to Obama in the 2008 presidential
> election.
>
> Senators worked throughout the day to find a bipartisan deal. McCain and
> four other Republicans unveiled their ideas priced at $445 billion, half the
> cost of Democratic version which started the day at $885 billion.
>
> It centered on cutting in half a 6.2 percent payroll tax on employees,
> cutting the corporate tax rate to 25 percent from 35 percent and lowering
> the bottom two income tax brackets to 10 percent and 5 percent, all for one
> year.
>
> McCain and Sens. Lindsey Graham of South Carolina, John Thune of South
> Dakota, Richard Burr of North Carolina and Mel Martinez of Florida also
> proposed $11 billion to help prevent home foreclosures and $65 billion in
> state grants to build and repair bridges and roads."
>
> Now the following are some examples of the non-job creating, non-economic
> stimulus spending that is included in the Democrat's $885 billion bill.
> Keep in mind that the purpose of the bill is to be a temporary, targeted
> stimulus to immediately create jobs and jump start the economy. It was not
> supposed to be loaded with welfare, entitlement, give away and social
> engineering spending. There are already multiple government agencies and
> spending bills to address those issues.
>
> "(CNN) -- On Monday, Congressional Republican leaders put out a list of what
> they call wasteful provisions in the Senate version of the nearly $900
> billion stimulus bill that is being debated:
>
> $2 billion earmark to re-start FutureGen, a near-zero emissions coal power
> plant in Illinois that the Department of Energy defunded last year because
> it said the project was inefficient.
>
> .. A $246 million tax break for Hollywood movie producers to buy motion
> picture film.
>
> .. $650 million for the digital television converter box coupon program.
>
> .. $88 million for the Coast Guard to design a new polar icebreaker (arctic
> ship).
>
> .. $448 million for constructing the Department of Homeland Security
> headquarters.
>
> .. $248 million for furniture at the new Homeland Security headquarters.
>
> .. $600 million to buy hybrid vehicles for federal employees.
>
> .. $400 million for the Centers for Disease Control to screen and prevent
> STD's.
>
> .. $1.4 billion for rural waste disposal programs.
>
> .. $125 million for the Washington sewer system.
>
> .. $150 million for Smithsonian museum facilities.
>
> .. $1 billion for the 2010 Census, which has a projected cost overrun of $3
> billion.
>
> .. $75 million for "smoking cessation activities."
>
> .. $200 million for public computer centers at community colleges.
>
> .. $75 million for salaries of employees at the FBI.
>
> .. $25 million for tribal alcohol and substance abuse reduction.
>
> .. $500 million for flood reduction projects on the Mississippi River.
>
> .. $10 million to inspect canals in urban areas.
>
> .. $6 billion to turn federal buildings into "green" buildings.
>
> .. $500 million for state and local fire stations.
>
> .. $650 million for wildland fire management on forest service lands.
>
> .. $1.2 billion for "youth activities," including youth summer job programs.
>
> .. $88 million for renovating the headquarters of the Public Health Service.
>
> .. $412 million for CDC buildings and property.
>
> .. $500 million for building and repairing National Institutes of Health
> facilities in Bethesda, Maryland.
>
> .. $160 million for "paid volunteers" at the Corporation for National and
> Community Service.
>
> .. $5.5 million for "energy efficiency initiatives" at the Department of
> Veterans Affairs National Cemetery Administration.
>
> .. $850 million for Amtrak.
>
> .. $100 million for reducing the hazard of lead-based paint.
>
> .. $75 million to construct a "security training" facility for State
> Department Security officers when they can be trained at existing facilities
> of other agencies.
>
> .. $110 million to the Farm Service Agency to upgrade computer systems.
>
> .. $200 million in funding for the lease of alternative energy vehicles for
> use on military installations. "
>
>
>
> And that list doesn't even include the $400 million for global warming
> research or the tens of millions that will go to ACORN, which is currently
> charged with voter fraud in 13 states. As I said, I don't hate Obama, I
> just don't trust him.
>
> Irish Mike

----- 
: the next generation of web-newsreaders : http://www.recgroups.com



  
Date: 07 Feb 2009 10:26:29
From: Bob T.
Subject: Re: This is why I don't trust Obama
On Feb 7, 10:04=A0am, "Irish Mike" <mjos...@ameritech.net > wrote:
> "Bob T." <b...@synapse-cs.com> wrote in message
>
> news:cb85de95-8016-49b0-a9e8-3fba712554d1@d36g2000prf.googlegroups.com...
> On Feb 6, 1:26 pm, "Irish Mike" <mjos...@ameritech.net> wrote:
>
>
>
>
>
> > "Senator Millionaire" <moon...@gmail.com> wrote in message
>
> >news:fb670590-40cd-4f23-a829-6290b94a97d3@f33g2000vbf.googlegroups.com..=
.
> > On Feb 5, 12:21 am, "Irish Mike" <mjos...@ameritech.net> wrote:
>
> > > I am a conservative first and a Republican second. I don't vote
> > > Republican
> > > because I think they are good, I vote Republican because I believe th=
e
> > > Democrats are worse. There are many things I am critical of the
> > > Republicans
> > > for in general and George Bush in particular.
>
> > > The Republicans have, for the most part, abandoned the conservative
> > > principles of small government, free markets, lower taxes and fiscal
> > > responsibility.
>
> > > Bush and Rumsfeld fucked up the execution of the Iraq war because the=
y
> > > tried
> > > to run it based on political objectives instead of letting the milita=
ry
> > > commanders on the ground make the strategic and tactical decisons. Th=
ey
> > > only returned partial control to the military when they had throughly
> > > fucked
> > > up the situation.
>
> > > Bush spent like a drunken liberal Democrat and pissed away billions o=
n
> > > half-assed entitlement programs instead of focusing on businesses, ne=
w
> > > jobs
> > > and working, tax paying middle class Americans.
>
> > > Bush was a terrible communicator and let the liberal Democrats attack
> > > and
> > > smear him, his adminstration and the Republican party without any
> > > effective
> > > response for eight years.
>
> > > Bush knew exactly how the Democrat sponsored subprine entitlement loa=
n
> > > programs were fucking up F-MAE and F-MAC and destroying the economy a=
nd
> > > never moved forcefully to stop them or to expose the damage they were
> > > doing.
>
> > > Bush did not do nearly enough to seal America's borders, identify the
> > > millions of illegal immigrants in this country and start an aggressiv=
e
> > > effort to deport them.
> > > Irish Mike
>
> > Somehow, I think the media was actually being nice to Bush when he
> > left the White House. According to the left-wing CBS News poll, Bush
> > left with a 22% approval rating. The lowest final approval rating EVER
> > from a departing President! Think about that? One in five people
> > thought Bush did a good job? I really find that hard to believe!
>
> >http://www.cbsnews.com/stories/2009/01/16/opinion/polls/main4728399.s...
>
> > My Bush calculations are probably much closer.
>
> > Democrats =3D 0%
> > Independents =3D 0%
> > Republicans =3D 1%
>
> > Total =3D 1%
>
> > Like I said, the media was just being nice.
>
> > Bush made a lot of mistakes although he was aggressive in fighting isla=
mic
> > terrorists and he prevented any islamic terrorist attacks on American s=
oil
> > for eight years.
>
> Um... that would be seven and a quarter years, Mike. =A0He did a really
> shitty job of defending us in his first nine months. =A0But heck, other
> than that Mrs. Lincoln, how did you enjoy the play?
>
> - Bob T.
>
> > Obama, so far, seems to be off on the wrong foot and I
> > have very little hope that his term will end up keeping us safer or bei=
ng
> > good for working, tax paying middle class Americans. He promised change
> > and
> > so far, it looks like the same old partisan politics as usual to me.
>
> > Irish Mike- Hide quoted text -
>
> > - Show quoted text -
>
> The 9/11 attack was planned on Clinton's watch and if he had pulled the
> trigger on OBL any of the times the CIA asked him to, 9/11 might never ha=
ve
> happened.

Once again, your framing is so distorted that your basically lying.

>=A0Obama says the war on terror is over

Only the phrase, not the intelligence activity, silly.

>and he threw out the Bush anti-terror defenses.

No he didn't.
>=A0He controls the white house,

Yes.

> congress, senate

No and no.

>and is commander in chief.

Yes. Two out of four - better than usual for you.

> =A0But if there is another terrorist attack on American
> soil, the liberal mainstream press isn't going to be able to cover Obama'=
s
> ass. =A0He will be a one term president, assuming he's not impeached.

In reality, it depends a great deal on the nature and timing of the
terrorist attack. If there is an attack next week, it will be obvious
to everyone except clueless right-wingers that it's more Bush's fault
than Obama's.

>=A0When Obama decided to roll the dice on America's security, he rolled th=
e dice on
> his own career as well.

Of course, Obama is not rolling the dice on America's security -
you're just lying again.

- Bob T.
>
> Irish Mike- Hide quoted text -
>
> - Show quoted text -



  
Date: 07 Feb 2009 06:12:39
From: Bob T.
Subject: Re: This is why I don't trust Obama
On Feb 7, 4:06=A0am, "Susan" <sdbrat...@netscape.net > wrote:
> "Dutch" <n...@email.com> wrote in message
>
> news:gmiqbp$v69$1@news.motzarella.org...
>
> > "Irish Mike" <mjos...@ameritech.net> wrote ..
>
> >> Bush made a lot of mistakes although he was aggressive in fighting
> >> islamic terrorists and he prevented any islamic terrorist attacks on
> >> American soil for eight years.
>
> > That is a logical fallacy. I haven't had a bald eagle sighting in my ba=
ck
> > yard in eight years either, does that mean something I did is directly
> > responsible for it?
>
> What do you think is responsible then? =A0(serious question re: attacks, =
not bald eagles)

It's a silly question, as Dutch's analogy points out. After 9/11,
whoever was president would have worked with a passionate Congress to
increase security. Al Gore would have increased airline security. Al
Gore would have invaded Afghanistan and taken out the al Qaeda bases
there and swept the Taliban out of power.

The real question, what _optional actions_ did Bush take to defend us
from Islamic terrorism? Well, the moron invaded Iraq instead of
securing Afghanistan. That made us less secure, not more.

As for the lack of attacks on American soil since 9/11, I give credit
to the thousands of Americans in the military and security agencies
who did the actual work, not to Bush.

- Bob T.
>
>
>
> > Even if we accept that policies during the Bush years were at least
> > partially responsible for stemming terrorist attacks, which is reasonab=
le,
> > that does not excuse the defining blunder of his administration, the
> > attack on Iraq, which only exacorbated anti-Americanism in the world an=
d
> > has done nothing to make America safer.- Hide quoted text -
>
> - Show quoted text -



  
Date: 07 Feb 2009 06:04:38
From: Bob T.
Subject: Re: This is why I don't trust Obama
On Feb 6, 1:26=A0pm, "Irish Mike" <mjos...@ameritech.net > wrote:
> "Senator Millionaire" <moon...@gmail.com> wrote in message
>
> news:fb670590-40cd-4f23-a829-6290b94a97d3@f33g2000vbf.googlegroups.com...
> On Feb 5, 12:21 am, "Irish Mike" <mjos...@ameritech.net> wrote:
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
> > I am a conservative first and a Republican second. I don't vote Republi=
can
> > because I think they are good, I vote Republican because I believe the
> > Democrats are worse. There are many things I am critical of the
> > Republicans
> > for in general and George Bush in particular.
>
> > The Republicans have, for the most part, abandoned the conservative
> > principles of small government, free markets, lower taxes and fiscal
> > responsibility.
>
> > Bush and Rumsfeld fucked up the execution of the Iraq war because they
> > tried
> > to run it based on political objectives instead of letting the military
> > commanders on the ground make the strategic and tactical decisons. They
> > only returned partial control to the military when they had throughly
> > fucked
> > up the situation.
>
> > Bush spent like a drunken liberal Democrat and pissed away billions on
> > half-assed entitlement programs instead of focusing on businesses, new
> > jobs
> > and working, tax paying middle class Americans.
>
> > Bush was a terrible communicator and let the liberal Democrats attack a=
nd
> > smear him, his adminstration and the Republican party without any
> > effective
> > response for eight years.
>
> > Bush knew exactly how the Democrat sponsored subprine entitlement loan
> > programs were fucking up F-MAE and F-MAC and destroying the economy and
> > never moved forcefully to stop them or to expose the damage they were
> > doing.
>
> > Bush did not do nearly enough to seal America's borders, identify the
> > millions of illegal immigrants in this country and start an aggressive
> > effort to deport them.
> > Irish Mike
>
> Somehow, I think the media was actually being nice to Bush when he
> left the White House. According to the left-wing CBS News poll, Bush
> left with a 22% approval rating. The lowest final approval rating EVER
> from a departing President! =A0Think about that? One in five people
> thought Bush did a good job? I really find that hard to believe!
>
> http://www.cbsnews.com/stories/2009/01/16/opinion/polls/main4728399.s...
>
> My Bush calculations are probably much closer.
>
> Democrats =3D 0%
> Independents =3D 0%
> Republicans =3D 1%
>
> Total =3D 1%
>
> Like I said, the media was just being nice.
>
> Bush made a lot of mistakes although he was aggressive in fighting islami=
c
> terrorists and he prevented any islamic terrorist attacks on American soi=
l
> for eight years.

Um... that would be seven and a quarter years, Mike. He did a really
shitty job of defending us in his first nine months. But heck, other
than that Mrs. Lincoln, how did you enjoy the play?

- Bob T.

> =A0Obama, so far, seems to be off on the wrong foot and I
> have very little hope that his term will end up keeping us safer or being
> good for working, tax paying middle class Americans. =A0He promised chang=
e and
> so far, it looks like the same old partisan politics as usual to me.
>
> Irish Mike- Hide quoted text -
>
> - Show quoted text -



   
Date: 07 Feb 2009 13:04:45
From: Irish Mike
Subject: Re: This is why I don't trust Obama

"Bob T." <bob@synapse-cs.com > wrote in message
news:cb85de95-8016-49b0-a9e8-3fba712554d1@d36g2000prf.googlegroups.com...
On Feb 6, 1:26 pm, "Irish Mike" <mjos...@ameritech.net > wrote:
> "Senator Millionaire" <moon...@gmail.com> wrote in message
>
> news:fb670590-40cd-4f23-a829-6290b94a97d3@f33g2000vbf.googlegroups.com...
> On Feb 5, 12:21 am, "Irish Mike" <mjos...@ameritech.net> wrote:
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
> > I am a conservative first and a Republican second. I don't vote
> > Republican
> > because I think they are good, I vote Republican because I believe the
> > Democrats are worse. There are many things I am critical of the
> > Republicans
> > for in general and George Bush in particular.
>
> > The Republicans have, for the most part, abandoned the conservative
> > principles of small government, free markets, lower taxes and fiscal
> > responsibility.
>
> > Bush and Rumsfeld fucked up the execution of the Iraq war because they
> > tried
> > to run it based on political objectives instead of letting the military
> > commanders on the ground make the strategic and tactical decisons. They
> > only returned partial control to the military when they had throughly
> > fucked
> > up the situation.
>
> > Bush spent like a drunken liberal Democrat and pissed away billions on
> > half-assed entitlement programs instead of focusing on businesses, new
> > jobs
> > and working, tax paying middle class Americans.
>
> > Bush was a terrible communicator and let the liberal Democrats attack
> > and
> > smear him, his adminstration and the Republican party without any
> > effective
> > response for eight years.
>
> > Bush knew exactly how the Democrat sponsored subprine entitlement loan
> > programs were fucking up F-MAE and F-MAC and destroying the economy and
> > never moved forcefully to stop them or to expose the damage they were
> > doing.
>
> > Bush did not do nearly enough to seal America's borders, identify the
> > millions of illegal immigrants in this country and start an aggressive
> > effort to deport them.
> > Irish Mike
>
> Somehow, I think the media was actually being nice to Bush when he
> left the White House. According to the left-wing CBS News poll, Bush
> left with a 22% approval rating. The lowest final approval rating EVER
> from a departing President! Think about that? One in five people
> thought Bush did a good job? I really find that hard to believe!
>
> http://www.cbsnews.com/stories/2009/01/16/opinion/polls/main4728399.s...
>
> My Bush calculations are probably much closer.
>
> Democrats = 0%
> Independents = 0%
> Republicans = 1%
>
> Total = 1%
>
> Like I said, the media was just being nice.
>
> Bush made a lot of mistakes although he was aggressive in fighting islamic
> terrorists and he prevented any islamic terrorist attacks on American soil
> for eight years.

Um... that would be seven and a quarter years, Mike. He did a really
shitty job of defending us in his first nine months. But heck, other
than that Mrs. Lincoln, how did you enjoy the play?

- Bob T.

> Obama, so far, seems to be off on the wrong foot and I
> have very little hope that his term will end up keeping us safer or being
> good for working, tax paying middle class Americans. He promised change
> and
> so far, it looks like the same old partisan politics as usual to me.
>
> Irish Mike- Hide quoted text -
>
> - Show quoted text -

The 9/11 attack was planned on Clinton's watch and if he had pulled the
trigger on OBL any of the times the CIA asked him to, 9/11 might never have
happened. Obama says the war on terror is over and he threw out the Bush
anti-terror defenses. He controls the white house, congress, senate and is
commander in chief. But if there is another terrorist attack on American
soil, the liberal mainstream press isn't going to be able to cover Obama's
ass. He will be a one term president, assuming he's not impeached. When
Obama decided to roll the dice on America's security, he rolled the dice on
his own career as well.

Irish Mike




    
Date: 07 Feb 2009 12:26:24
From: Dutch
Subject: Re: This is why I don't trust Obama
"Irish Mike" <mjostar@ameritech.net > wrote
>Obama says the war on terror is over

Obama personally authorized air strikes on Al Qaeda camps in Pakistan the
same day he said that.

The era of deceiving the public with simple-minded slogans like "war on
terror" and "axis of evil" has ended, the era of pursuing actual villains
has begun.




  
Date: 06 Feb 2009 17:29:21
From: Senator Millionaire
Subject: Re: This is why I don't trust Obama
On Feb 6, 4:26=A0pm, "Irish Mike" <mjos...@ameritech.net > wrote:
>
> Bush made a lot of mistakes although he was aggressive in fighting islami=
c
> terrorists and he prevented any islamic terrorist attacks on American soi=
l
> for eight years. =A0Obama, so far, seems to be off on the wrong foot and =
I
> have very little hope that his term will end up keeping us safer or being
> good for working, tax paying middle class Americans. =A0He promised chang=
e and
> so far, it looks like the same old partisan politics as usual to me.
>
> Irish Mike

Bush doesn't deserve any credit for anything as far as I'm concerned.
The man wasn't qualified to be President from day one. The 9-11 attack
was preventable and the fact that no airliners were intercepted is his
fault period. The military gets the credit for taking out the Taliban
not Bush.

I have not met one person who said Bush has done a good job so that
22% final approval rating by CBS news is bullshit too.



   
Date: 06 Feb 2009 21:27:00
From: Irish Mike
Subject: Re: This is why I don't trust Obama

"Senator Millionaire" <moone99@gmail.com > wrote in message
news:a2d1c56d-25de-4f1e-a694-5cfda0914c86@k19g2000yqg.googlegroups.com...
On Feb 6, 4:26 pm, "Irish Mike" <mjos...@ameritech.net > wrote:
>
> Bush made a lot of mistakes although he was aggressive in fighting islamic
> terrorists and he prevented any islamic terrorist attacks on American soil
> for eight years. Obama, so far, seems to be off on the wrong foot and I
> have very little hope that his term will end up keeping us safer or being
> good for working, tax paying middle class Americans. He promised change
> and
> so far, it looks like the same old partisan politics as usual to me.
>
> Irish Mike

Bush doesn't deserve any credit for anything as far as I'm concerned.
The man wasn't qualified to be President from day one. The 9-11 attack
was preventable and the fact that no airliners were intercepted is his
fault period. The military gets the credit for taking out the Taliban
not Bush.

I have not met one person who said Bush has done a good job so that
22% final approval rating by CBS news is bullshit too.

Bush does deserve credit for the things he has done correctly and for
keeping this country safe from islamic terrorist attacks on our soil for the
past eight years. But here the key point bucko - Bush isn't president any
more. Obama is in charge and he controls the white house, congtress and
senate. He made a decsion to rip down every thing president Bush did,
including national defense. OK, that's his right. But he declared that the
war on terror is over and puta left wing hack (Panetta) in charge of
dismantling the CIA and handcuffing American's intelligence gathering
techniques. He said we can no longer use any type of enhanced interogation
techniques. In fact, he has decreed that America can not do any thing that
makes a captured terrorist feel uncomfortable and he announced this to our
enemies. He said he will meet with the leaders of terrorist states without
conditions. So now, it's Obama's war. If he cuts and runs in Iraq, and we
lose the gains that have been made there, it's on Obama. If any Americans
die because we no longer have the information we would have had if we had
the option of using enhanced interogation techniques, their blood is on
Obama's hands. If there is another terrorist attack on American soil, the
blood of those who die is on Obama's hands.

And now, by supporting this disgraceful, totally partisan Congressional pork
barrel $900 billion entitlement and welfare spending bill, the American
economic disaster is now on Obama and the Democrats. Which is where much of
it should have been from the beginning. The Demcorats controlled Congress
for the last two years and Chris Dodd and Barney Frank chaired all of the
banking and finance committees for the last two years. Obama was an ACORN
arm twister, played the race card on banks that didn't want to make high
risk subprime loans and helped file a law suit that caused banks all across
the country to lower their lending standards for high risk loans.

So that old "but Bush" dog won't hunt any more. Liberals attacked,
insulted, disparaged and crucified him every day for eight straight years.
Now it's time for their Messiah to stop campaigning and actually deliver
some thing, Sad to say, so far it's only been crooks, tax cheats and
partisan politics as usual.

Irish Mike




   
Date: 06 Feb 2009 17:51:59
From: brewmaster
Subject: Re: This is why I don't trust Obama
On Feb 6 2009 5:29 PM, Senator Millionaire wrote:

> On Feb 6, 4:26 pm, "Irish Mike" <mjos...@ameritech.net> wrote:
> >
> > Bush made a lot of mistakes although he was aggressive in fighting islamic
> > terrorists and he prevented any islamic terrorist attacks on American soil
> > for eight years.  Obama, so far, seems to be off on the wrong foot and I
> > have very little hope that his term will end up keeping us safer or being
> > good for working, tax paying middle class Americans.  He promised change
and
> > so far, it looks like the same old partisan politics as usual to me.
> >
> > Irish Mike
>
> Bush doesn't deserve any credit for anything as far as I'm concerned.
> The man wasn't qualified to be President from day one. The 9-11 attack
> was preventable and the fact that no airliners were intercepted is his
> fault period. The military gets the credit for taking out the Taliban
> not Bush.
>
> I have not met one person who said Bush has done a good job so that
> 22% final approval rating by CBS news is bullshit too.

Most people have no business judging the performance of a president.
People think Johnson was a good president and Nixon was a bad one, which
is 100% backwards.

Brew
--
Email me here: http://tinymail.me/k4r2nk

______________________________________________________________________ 
: the next generation of web-newsreaders : http://www.recgroups.com



    
Date: 06 Feb 2009 21:29:10
From: Irish Mike
Subject: Re: This is why I don't trust Obama

"brewmaster" <a163b@webnntp.invalid > wrote in message
news:v26v56xhs1.ln2@recgroups.com...
> On Feb 6 2009 5:29 PM, Senator Millionaire wrote:
>
>> On Feb 6, 4:26 pm, "Irish Mike" <mjos...@ameritech.net> wrote:
>> >
>> > Bush made a lot of mistakes although he was aggressive in fighting
>> > islamic
>> > terrorists and he prevented any islamic terrorist attacks on American
>> > soil
>> > for eight years. Obama, so far, seems to be off on the wrong foot and I
>> > have very little hope that his term will end up keeping us safer or
>> > being
>> > good for working, tax paying middle class Americans. He promised change
> and
>> > so far, it looks like the same old partisan politics as usual to me.
>> >
>> > Irish Mike
>>
>> Bush doesn't deserve any credit for anything as far as I'm concerned.
>> The man wasn't qualified to be President from day one. The 9-11 attack
>> was preventable and the fact that no airliners were intercepted is his
>> fault period. The military gets the credit for taking out the Taliban
>> not Bush.
>>
>> I have not met one person who said Bush has done a good job so that
>> 22% final approval rating by CBS news is bullshit too.
>
> Most people have no business judging the performance of a president.
> People think Johnson was a good president and Nixon was a bad one, which
> is 100% backwards.
>
> Brew

Good point. At his inaguration, Jimmy Carter had one of the highest
presidential approval ratings in history. Turned out to be one of the worst
presidents in history.

Irish Mike




  
Date: 05 Feb 2009 11:03:56
From: Senator Millionaire
Subject: Re: This is why I don't trust Obama
On Feb 5, 12:21=A0am, "Irish Mike" <mjos...@ameritech.net > wrote:
>
> I am a conservative first and a Republican second. =A0I don't vote Republ=
ican
> because I think they are good, I vote Republican because I believe the
> Democrats are worse. =A0There are many things I am critical of the Republ=
icans
> for in general and George Bush in particular.
>
> The Republicans have, for the most part, abandoned the conservative
> principles of small government, free markets, lower taxes and fiscal
> responsibility.
>
> Bush and Rumsfeld fucked up the execution of the Iraq war because they tr=
ied
> to run it based on political objectives instead of letting the military
> commanders on the ground make the strategic and tactical decisons. =A0The=
y
> only returned partial control to the military when they had throughly fuc=
ked
> up the situation.
>
> Bush spent like a drunken liberal Democrat and pissed away billions on
> half-assed entitlement programs instead of focusing on businesses, new jo=
bs
> and working, tax paying middle class Americans.
>
> Bush was a terrible communicator and let the liberal Democrats attack and
> smear him, his adminstration and the Republican party without any effecti=
ve
> response for eight years.
>
> Bush knew exactly how the Democrat sponsored subprine entitlement loan
> programs were fucking up F-MAE and F-MAC and destroying the economy and
> never moved forcefully to stop them or to expose the damage they were doi=
ng.
>
> Bush did not do nearly enough to seal America's borders, identify the
> millions of illegal immigrants in this country and start an aggressive
> effort to deport them.

> Irish Mike

Somehow, I think the media was actually being nice to Bush when he
left the White House. According to the left-wing CBS News poll, Bush
left with a 22% approval rating. The lowest final approval rating EVER
from a departing President! Think about that? One in five people
thought Bush did a good job? I really find that hard to believe!

http://www.cbsnews.com/stories/2009/01/16/opinion/polls/main4728399.shtml

My Bush calculations are probably much closer.

Democrats =3D 0%
Independents =3D 0%
Republicans =3D 1%

Total =3D 1%

Like I said, the media was just being nice.





   
Date: 06 Feb 2009 16:26:02
From: Irish Mike
Subject: Re: This is why I don't trust Obama

"Senator Millionaire" <moone99@gmail.com > wrote in message
news:fb670590-40cd-4f23-a829-6290b94a97d3@f33g2000vbf.googlegroups.com...
On Feb 5, 12:21 am, "Irish Mike" <mjos...@ameritech.net > wrote:
>
> I am a conservative first and a Republican second. I don't vote Republican
> because I think they are good, I vote Republican because I believe the
> Democrats are worse. There are many things I am critical of the
> Republicans
> for in general and George Bush in particular.
>
> The Republicans have, for the most part, abandoned the conservative
> principles of small government, free markets, lower taxes and fiscal
> responsibility.
>
> Bush and Rumsfeld fucked up the execution of the Iraq war because they
> tried
> to run it based on political objectives instead of letting the military
> commanders on the ground make the strategic and tactical decisons. They
> only returned partial control to the military when they had throughly
> fucked
> up the situation.
>
> Bush spent like a drunken liberal Democrat and pissed away billions on
> half-assed entitlement programs instead of focusing on businesses, new
> jobs
> and working, tax paying middle class Americans.
>
> Bush was a terrible communicator and let the liberal Democrats attack and
> smear him, his adminstration and the Republican party without any
> effective
> response for eight years.
>
> Bush knew exactly how the Democrat sponsored subprine entitlement loan
> programs were fucking up F-MAE and F-MAC and destroying the economy and
> never moved forcefully to stop them or to expose the damage they were
> doing.
>
> Bush did not do nearly enough to seal America's borders, identify the
> millions of illegal immigrants in this country and start an aggressive
> effort to deport them.

> Irish Mike

Somehow, I think the media was actually being nice to Bush when he
left the White House. According to the left-wing CBS News poll, Bush
left with a 22% approval rating. The lowest final approval rating EVER
from a departing President! Think about that? One in five people
thought Bush did a good job? I really find that hard to believe!

http://www.cbsnews.com/stories/2009/01/16/opinion/polls/main4728399.shtml

My Bush calculations are probably much closer.

Democrats = 0%
Independents = 0%
Republicans = 1%

Total = 1%

Like I said, the media was just being nice.

Bush made a lot of mistakes although he was aggressive in fighting islamic
terrorists and he prevented any islamic terrorist attacks on American soil
for eight years. Obama, so far, seems to be off on the wrong foot and I
have very little hope that his term will end up keeping us safer or being
good for working, tax paying middle class Americans. He promised change and
so far, it looks like the same old partisan politics as usual to me.

Irish Mike





    
Date: 06 Feb 2009 18:06:35
From: Dutch
Subject: Re: This is why I don't trust Obama
"Irish Mike" <mjostar@ameritech.net > wrote ..
>
> Bush made a lot of mistakes although he was aggressive in fighting islamic
> terrorists and he prevented any islamic terrorist attacks on American soil
> for eight years.

That is a logical fallacy. I haven't had a bald eagle sighting in my back
yard in eight years either, does that mean something I did is directly
responsible for it?

Even if we accept that policies during the Bush years were at least
partially responsible for stemming terrorist attacks, which is reasonable,
that does not excuse the defining blunder of his administration, the attack
on Iraq, which only exacorbated anti-Americanism in the world and has done
nothing to make America safer.



     
Date: 07 Feb 2009 06:06:27
From: Susan
Subject: Re: This is why I don't trust Obama

"Dutch" <no@email.com > wrote in message
news:gmiqbp$v69$1@news.motzarella.org...
> "Irish Mike" <mjostar@ameritech.net> wrote ..
>>
>> Bush made a lot of mistakes although he was aggressive in fighting
>> islamic terrorists and he prevented any islamic terrorist attacks on
>> American soil for eight years.
>
> That is a logical fallacy. I haven't had a bald eagle sighting in my back
> yard in eight years either, does that mean something I did is directly
> responsible for it?

What do you think is responsible then? (serious question re: attacks, not
bald eagles)


> Even if we accept that policies during the Bush years were at least
> partially responsible for stemming terrorist attacks, which is reasonable,
> that does not excuse the defining blunder of his administration, the
> attack on Iraq, which only exacorbated anti-Americanism in the world and
> has done nothing to make America safer.




  
Date: 04 Feb 2009 23:41:45
From: Bob T.
Subject: Re: This is why I don't trust Obama
On Feb 4, 9:32=A0pm, "Clave" <ClaviusNoSpamDam...@cablespeed.com > wrote:
> "Irish Mike" <mjos...@ameritech.net> wrote in message
>
> news:uHuil.12999$as4.2653@nlpi069.nbdc.sbc.com...
>
>
>
> > "JerseyRudy" <a44f...@webnntp.invalid> wrote in message
> >news:6d0p56xfl4.ln2@recgroups.com...
> >> On Feb 4 2009 11:36 AM, Senator Millionaire wrote:
>
> >>> Does Irish Mike ever critique the Republican party?
>
> >> He criticized the GOP for nominating Lincoln in 1860 and 1864. Since t=
hen
> >> he has agreed with them on everything."
>
> > I am a conservative first and a Republican second. =A0I don't vote
> > Republican because I think they are good, I vote Republican because I
> > believe the Democrats are worse. =A0There are many things I am critical=
of
> > the Republicans for in general and George Bush in particular...
>
> Could I ask the community here just how vocal Mikey's criticism of Bush a=
nd
> the Republicans was over the last eight years?

He did criticize Cheney for having poor aim that one time...

- Bob T.
>
> Jim



   
Date: 04 Feb 2009 23:47:48
From: Clave
Subject: Re: This is why I don't trust Obama
"Bob T." <bob@synapse-cs.com > wrote in message
news:8b46b52c-069a-4869-ac08-a37f61aca4b8@r15g2000prh.googlegroups.com...
On Feb 4, 9:32 pm, "Clave" <ClaviusNoSpamDam...@cablespeed.com > wrote:
> "Irish Mike" <mjos...@ameritech.net> wrote in message

<... >

> > I am a conservative first and a Republican second. I don't vote
> > Republican because I think they are good, I vote Republican because I
> > believe the Democrats are worse. There are many things I am critical of
> > the Republicans for in general and George Bush in particular...
>
> Could I ask the community here just how vocal Mikey's criticism of Bush
> and the Republicans was over the last eight years?

He did criticize Cheney for having poor aim that one time...
============================================================================

Funny, but I don't think he even did that.

Jim




    
Date: 05 Feb 2009 07:35:13
From: da pickle
Subject: Re: This is why I don't trust Obama
"Clave"

>> Could I ask the community here just how vocal Mikey's criticism of Bush
>> and the Republicans was over the last eight years?
>
> He did criticize Cheney for having poor aim that one time...
> ============================================================================
>
> Funny, but I don't think he even did that.

And yet, when asked for his criticism of "Republicans" ... and he gives it
... we get only "but what about the last eight years" ... hummmmm.

Not a word about the long list of conclusions about the last eight years.

Would it hurt for you to say, if it is true, of course:

"I agree with you, Mike." Or, "I mostly agree with you, Mike."

Or, "I disagree with your comment, Mike, that the Republicans should be
criticized for [insert your disagreement here] ..."




  
Date: 04 Feb 2009 09:31:05
From:
Subject: Re: This is why I don't trust Obama
On Feb 4, 10:49=A0am, "da pickle" <jcpick...@NOSPAMhotmail.com > wrote:
> <tranger...@hotmail.com> wrote
>
> > Mike makes a pretty good Archie and there are many here that fit the
> > meathead personality. Mike may not be quite as funny but he is often ri=
ght
> > (in substance) in his very "right" wing rants. Often, those that nit pi=
ck
> > his presentation and ignore the half correct observations are being the=
ir
> > own variant of meathead.
>
> Wait...if he's half wrong/half right and not funny, doesnt that make
> him Michael Stivic in your analogy above?
> =3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=
=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D
>
> Did you miss the "right" wing nut part?
>
> And its kind of annoying
> that he uses the "Messiah" tagline and the "thrill ran up my leg"
> shtick. =A0Do people really think this is funny?
> =3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=
=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D
>
> It is not funny at all the 100th time. =A0It is still right ... in the se=
nse
> "correct" ... but that is the part that is really not funny any more. =A0=
BUT,
> it is an example, one of many, about the obsession of the media with the =
new
> president. =A0

Isnt my example of George "Fool me once, shame on =97 shame on you. Fool
me =97 you can't get fooled again" Bush right (correct)? And isnt it
indicative of his ineptitude?

And when those on RGP continue with the "messiah" complex, Mike
> is "right" (correct) in continuing with his repetition ... but it is stil=
l
> not funny.

But the thing is, I truly believe he thinks he IS funny. And thats
what people attack him for. Because he makes really ignorant
comments, and backs them up by saying "well bucko, maybe you'll take
responsibility when the terrorists strike". Its very difficult to
argue with someone who doesnt think in a logical manner.

> Those that ignore the substance (of the message) and attack (make fun of)
> the messenger ... well, they are the unfunny Michael Stivic "meatheads" .=
..
> but the whole thing is lost when it has to be explained.

Thanks for the explanation, I never saw "All in the Family", it was
before my time.

Having said all this, I dont necessarily think IM's post is all
wrong. I just think its laughable that he defended the same kind of
spending under GWB and the expansion of the Federal govt, and he's now
complaining becaust the person doing it has a D after their name.



  
Date: 04 Feb 2009 08:36:45
From: Senator Millionaire
Subject: Re: This is why I don't trust Obama
Does Irish Mike ever critique the Republican party?


   
Date: 04 Feb 2009 09:44:10
From: RazzO
Subject: Re: This is why I don't trust Obama
He once stated that the former presidents ratings may have been a little
to low.



On Feb 4 2009 8:36 AM, Senator Millionaire wrote:

> Does Irish Mike ever critique the Republican party?


RazzO

(...)

_______________________________________________________________________ 
: the next generation of web-newsreaders : http://www.recgroups.com



   
Date: 04 Feb 2009 09:38:14
From: JerseyRudy
Subject: Re: This is why I don't trust Obama
On Feb 4 2009 11:36 AM, Senator Millionaire wrote:

> Does Irish Mike ever critique the Republican party?


He criticized the GOP for nominating Lincoln in 1860 and 1864. Since then
he has agreed with them on everything.

_____________________________________________________________________ 
: the next generation of web-newsreaders : http://www.recgroups.com



    
Date: 05 Feb 2009 00:21:29
From: Irish Mike
Subject: Re: This is why I don't trust Obama

"JerseyRudy" <a44f915@webnntp.invalid > wrote in message
news:6d0p56xfl4.ln2@recgroups.com...
> On Feb 4 2009 11:36 AM, Senator Millionaire wrote:
>
>> Does Irish Mike ever critique the Republican party?
>
>
> He criticized the GOP for nominating Lincoln in 1860 and 1864. Since then
> he has agreed with them on everything."

I am a conservative first and a Republican second. I don't vote Republican
because I think they are good, I vote Republican because I believe the
Democrats are worse. There are many things I am critical of the Republicans
for in general and George Bush in particular.

The Republicans have, for the most part, abandoned the conservative
principles of small government, free markets, lower taxes and fiscal
responsibility.

Bush and Rumsfeld fucked up the execution of the Iraq war because they tried
to run it based on political objectives instead of letting the military
commanders on the ground make the strategic and tactical decisons. They
only returned partial control to the military when they had throughly fucked
up the situation.

Bush spent like a drunken liberal Democrat and pissed away billions on
half-assed entitlement programs instead of focusing on businesses, new jobs
and working, tax paying middle class Americans.

Bush was a terrible communicator and let the liberal Democrats attack and
smear him, his adminstration and the Republican party without any effective
response for eight years.

Bush knew exactly how the Democrat sponsored subprine entitlement loan
programs were fucking up F-MAE and F-MAC and destroying the economy and
never moved forcefully to stop them or to expose the damage they were doing.

Bush did not do nearly enough to seal America's borders, identify the
millions of illegal immigrants in this country and start an aggressive
effort to deport them.

I didn't like Bush but voted for him twice because I believe he was less
dangerous and destructive than either Gore or Kerry. As I've said before, I
don't hate Obama, I just don't trust him. Obama has been in office two
weeks and has made two major blunders. The first was appointing a bunch of
crooks and tax cheats to his cabinet. The second was this disgraceful $ 900
billion welfare, entitlement and social engineering spending bill prepared
unilaterally by left wing congressional Democrats with no Republican input.

Irish Mike




     
Date: 05 Feb 2009 09:11:21
From: Kyle T. Jones
Subject: Re: This is why I don't trust Obama
Irish Mike, my dear, dear friend, there was this time, oh, 2/4/2009
11:21 PM or thereabouts, when you let the following craziness loose on
Usenet:
> "JerseyRudy" <a44f915@webnntp.invalid> wrote in message
> news:6d0p56xfl4.ln2@recgroups.com...
>> On Feb 4 2009 11:36 AM, Senator Millionaire wrote:
>>
>>> Does Irish Mike ever critique the Republican party?
>>
>> He criticized the GOP for nominating Lincoln in 1860 and 1864. Since then
>> he has agreed with them on everything."
>
> I am a conservative first and a Republican second. I don't vote Republican
> because I think they are good, I vote Republican because I believe the
> Democrats are worse. There are many things I am critical of the Republicans
> for in general and George Bush in particular.
>
> The Republicans have, for the most part, abandoned the conservative
> principles of small government, free markets, lower taxes and fiscal
> responsibility.
>
> Bush and Rumsfeld fucked up the execution of the Iraq war because they tried
> to run it based on political objectives instead of letting the military
> commanders on the ground make the strategic and tactical decisons. They
> only returned partial control to the military when they had throughly fucked
> up the situation.
>
> Bush spent like a drunken liberal Democrat and pissed away billions on
> half-assed entitlement programs instead of focusing on businesses, new jobs
> and working, tax paying middle class Americans.
>
> Bush was a terrible communicator and let the liberal Democrats attack and
> smear him, his adminstration and the Republican party without any effective
> response for eight years.
>
> Bush knew exactly how the Democrat sponsored subprine entitlement loan
> programs were fucking up F-MAE and F-MAC and destroying the economy and
> never moved forcefully to stop them or to expose the damage they were doing.
>
> Bush did not do nearly enough to seal America's borders, identify the
> millions of illegal immigrants in this country and start an aggressive
> effort to deport them.
>
> I didn't like Bush but voted for him twice because I believe he was less
> dangerous and destructive than either Gore or Kerry. As I've said before, I
> don't hate Obama, I just don't trust him. Obama has been in office two
> weeks and has made two major blunders. The first was appointing a bunch of
> crooks and tax cheats to his cabinet. The second was this disgraceful $ 900
> billion welfare, entitlement and social engineering spending bill prepared
> unilaterally by left wing congressional Democrats with no Republican input.
>
> Irish Mike
>
>


Wow, Mike - way to throw Bush under that there bus yer always talking
about!!!!1!

Cheers.


     
Date: 04 Feb 2009 21:32:47
From: Clave
Subject: Re: This is why I don't trust Obama
"Irish Mike" <mjostar@ameritech.net > wrote in message
news:uHuil.12999$as4.2653@nlpi069.nbdc.sbc.com...
>
> "JerseyRudy" <a44f915@webnntp.invalid> wrote in message
> news:6d0p56xfl4.ln2@recgroups.com...
>> On Feb 4 2009 11:36 AM, Senator Millionaire wrote:
>>
>>> Does Irish Mike ever critique the Republican party?
>>
>>
>> He criticized the GOP for nominating Lincoln in 1860 and 1864. Since then
>> he has agreed with them on everything."
>
> I am a conservative first and a Republican second. I don't vote
> Republican because I think they are good, I vote Republican because I
> believe the Democrats are worse. There are many things I am critical of
> the Republicans for in general and George Bush in particular...

Could I ask the community here just how vocal Mikey's criticism of Bush and
the Republicans was over the last eight years?

Jim




  
Date: 04 Feb 2009 08:34:40
From:
Subject: Re: This is why I don't trust Obama
On Feb 4, 10:19=A0am, "Irish Mike" <mjos...@ameritech.net > wrote:
> I never make a political post that I don't believe is insightful, accurat=
e
> and truthful. =A0The day no one on RGP argues with me about them is the d=
ay
> I.Q.s rise 50 points and some one shoots all the left wing liberals,
> atheists and pro-murder abortionists dead.
>
> Irish Mike

Mike, this is simply a lie. You claim repeatedly that Bush has
prevented any terrorist attack in the US since 9/11. The anthrax
attacks were both terrorist attacks and after 9/11/01. I have pointed
this out to you on a number of occasions.

You probably won't respond to this post, as I believe you have me
kilfilled, but for other people who might take you seriously, I hope
this shows them that you are dishonest.



  
Date: 04 Feb 2009 07:49:34
From:
Subject: Re: This is why I don't trust Obama
On Feb 4, 9:41=A0am, "brewmaster" <a1...@webnntp.invalid > wrote:
> On Feb 4 2009 7:09 AM, trangers16 wrote:
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
> > On Feb 4, 9:02=A0am, "da pickle" <jcpickels@(nospam)hotmail.com> wrote:
> > > "Senator Millionaire"
>
> > > > Irish Mike, why did Bush and the Republicans CREATE the Dept. of
> > > > Homeland Security?
>
> > > > What a fucking waste of taxpayer money!!! The FBI should have been
> > > > awarded the money! That's their fuckin' job!! Republicans and small=
er
> > > > government is a crock of fuckin' shit!
>
> > > Seems like a good rant to me. =A0But where is the "other side?"
>
> > > It can be worse.
>
> > > I heard a good analogy the other day ... someone was watching old rer=
uns of
> > > All in the Family and identifying Archie Bunker as half right and hal=
f
> wrong
> > > on his rants but always funny ... and Michael Stivic as half right an=
d half
> > > wrong on his rants but always a total and complete non-funny and anno=
ying
> > > ... well ... meathead.
>
> > > Mike makes a pretty good Archie and there are many here that fit the
> > > meathead personality. =A0Mike may not be quite as funny but he is oft=
en right
> > > (in substance) in his very "right" wing rants. =A0Often, those that n=
it pick
> > > his presentation and ignore the half correct observations are being t=
heir
> > > own variant of meathead.
>
> > Wait...if he's half wrong/half right and not funny, doesnt that make
> > him Michael Stivic in your analogy above? =A0And its kind of annoying
> > that he uses the "Messiah" tagline and the "thrill ran up my leg"
> > shtick. =A0Do people really think this is funny?
>
> You know that the "thrill ran up my leg" came directly from the mouth of
> Chris Matthews, right?
>
> Brew
> --
> Email me here:http://tinymail.me/k4r2nk
>
> -------=A0
> * kill-files, watch-lists, favorites, and more..www.recgroups.com- Hide q=
uoted text -
>
> - Show quoted text -

Yep. Its just not that funny imo. In fact, I cant think of any joke
(or line) that is still funny after hearing it dozens of times. Its
like saying George "Fool me once, shame on me, fool me
twice...well....shame on...just dont fool me twice" Bush. Reading it
the first time you might chuckel, after the 100th time, you wonder if
the person has an obsession...


   
Date: 04 Feb 2009 08:06:58
From: JerseyRudy
Subject: Re: This is why I don't trust Obama
On Feb 4 2009 10:49 AM, trangers16 wrote:

> On Feb 4, 9:41 am, "brewmaster" <a1...@webnntp.invalid> wrote:
> > On Feb 4 2009 7:09 AM, trangers16 wrote:
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> > > On Feb 4, 9:02 am, "da pickle" <jcpickels@(nospam)hotmail.com> wrote:
> > > > "Senator Millionaire"
> >
> > > > > Irish Mike, why did Bush and the Republicans CREATE the Dept. of
> > > > > Homeland Security?
> >
> > > > > What a fucking waste of taxpayer money!!! The FBI should have been
> > > > > awarded the money! That's their fuckin' job!! Republicans and smaller
> > > > > government is a crock of fuckin' shit!
> >
> > > > Seems like a good rant to me.  But where is the "other side?"
> >
> > > > It can be worse.
> >
> > > > I heard a good analogy the other day ... someone was watching old
reruns of
> > > > All in the Family and identifying Archie Bunker as half right and half
> > wrong
> > > > on his rants but always funny ... and Michael Stivic as half right and
half
> > > > wrong on his rants but always a total and complete non-funny and
annoying
> > > > ... well ... meathead.
> >
> > > > Mike makes a pretty good Archie and there are many here that fit the
> > > > meathead personality.  Mike may not be quite as funny but he is often
right
> > > > (in substance) in his very "right" wing rants.  Often, those that nit
pick
> > > > his presentation and ignore the half correct observations are being
their
> > > > own variant of meathead.
> >
> > > Wait...if he's half wrong/half right and not funny, doesnt that make
> > > him Michael Stivic in your analogy above?  And its kind of annoying
> > > that he uses the "Messiah" tagline and the "thrill ran up my leg"
> > > shtick.  Do people really think this is funny?
> >
> > You know that the "thrill ran up my leg" came directly from the mouth of
> > Chris Matthews, right?
> >
> > Brew
> > --
> > Email me here:http://tinymail.me/k4r2nk
> >
> - Show quoted text -
>
> Yep. Its just not that funny imo. In fact, I cant think of any joke
> (or line) that is still funny after hearing it dozens of times. Its
> like saying George "Fool me once, shame on me, fool me
> twice...well....shame on...just dont fool me twice" Bush. Reading it
> the first time you might chuckel, after the 100th time, you wonder if
> the person has an obsession...

Irish Mike is obsessed with Obama? I'm no psychologist, but you might be
on to something here.

--- 
looking for a better newsgroup-reader? - www.recgroups.com




    
Date: 04 Feb 2009 11:15:02
From: da pickle
Subject: Re: This is why I don't trust Obama
"JerseyRudy"

> Irish Mike is obsessed with Obama? I'm no psychologist, but you might be
> on to something here.

Perhaps, the two of you might attend a group therapy session.




  
Date: 04 Feb 2009 07:09:21
From:
Subject: Re: This is why I don't trust Obama
On Feb 4, 9:02=A0am, "da pickle" <jcpickels@(nospam)hotmail.com > wrote:
> "Senator Millionaire"
>
> > Irish Mike, why did Bush and the Republicans CREATE the Dept. of
> > Homeland Security?
>
> > What a fucking waste of taxpayer money!!! The FBI should have been
> > awarded the money! That's their fuckin' job!! Republicans and smaller
> > government is a crock of fuckin' shit!
>
> Seems like a good rant to me. =A0But where is the "other side?"
>
> It can be worse.
>
> I heard a good analogy the other day ... someone was watching old reruns =
of
> All in the Family and identifying Archie Bunker as half right and half wr=
ong
> on his rants but always funny ... and Michael Stivic as half right and ha=
lf
> wrong on his rants but always a total and complete non-funny and annoying
> ... well ... meathead.
>
> Mike makes a pretty good Archie and there are many here that fit the
> meathead personality. =A0Mike may not be quite as funny but he is often r=
ight
> (in substance) in his very "right" wing rants. =A0Often, those that nit p=
ick
> his presentation and ignore the half correct observations are being their
> own variant of meathead.

Wait...if he's half wrong/half right and not funny, doesnt that make
him Michael Stivic in your analogy above? And its kind of annoying
that he uses the "Messiah" tagline and the "thrill ran up my leg"
shtick. Do people really think this is funny?


   
Date: 04 Feb 2009 10:49:42
From: da pickle
Subject: Re: This is why I don't trust Obama
<trangers16@hotmail.com > wrote

> Mike makes a pretty good Archie and there are many here that fit the
> meathead personality. Mike may not be quite as funny but he is often right
> (in substance) in his very "right" wing rants. Often, those that nit pick
> his presentation and ignore the half correct observations are being their
> own variant of meathead.

Wait...if he's half wrong/half right and not funny, doesnt that make
him Michael Stivic in your analogy above?
==============================

Did you miss the "right" wing nut part?


And its kind of annoying
that he uses the "Messiah" tagline and the "thrill ran up my leg"
shtick. Do people really think this is funny?
===============================

It is not funny at all the 100th time. It is still right ... in the sense
"correct" ... but that is the part that is really not funny any more. BUT,
it is an example, one of many, about the obsession of the media with the new
president. And when those on RGP continue with the "messiah" complex, Mike
is "right" (correct) in continuing with his repetition ... but it is still
not funny.

Those that ignore the substance (of the message) and attack (make fun of)
the messenger ... well, they are the unfunny Michael Stivic "meatheads" ...
but the whole thing is lost when it has to be explained.




    
Date: 04 Feb 2009 09:36:12
From: John_Brian_K
Subject: Re: This is why I don't trust Obama
> Those that ignore the substance (of the message) and attack (make fun of)
> the messenger ... well, they are the unfunny Michael Stivic "meatheads" ...
> but the whole thing is lost when it has to be explained.

Pickle you would know this. What color does a pickle get when it is
rotten or beyond fresh?

==========================================
You must not think me necessarily foolish because I am facetious,
nor will I consider you necessarily wise because you are grave.
==============================
47.5% of all statistics are made up on the spot.
JBK

------- 
* kill-files, watch-lists, favorites, and more.. www.recgroups.com



     
Date: 04 Feb 2009 18:16:00
From: da pickle
Subject: Re: This is why I don't trust Obama
"John_Brian_K"

> Pickle you would know this. What color does a pickle get when it is
> rotten or beyond fresh?

What?




      
Date: 04 Feb 2009 18:43:51
From: John_Brian_K
Subject: Re: This is why I don't trust Obama
> > Pickle you would know this. What color does a pickle get when it is
> > rotten or beyond fresh?
>
> What?

I was picking out a few new colors on Recgroups to make certain people
appear with different colors. I made you green for a pickle, but I wanted
to make your impostor a completely rotten pickle type color.

It seemed to fit.

==========================================
You must not think me necessarily foolish because I am facetious,
nor will I consider you necessarily wise because you are grave.
==============================
47.5% of all statistics are made up on the spot.
JBK

------ 
: the next generation of web-newsreaders : http://www.recgroups.com



       
Date: 05 Feb 2009 07:27:39
From: da pickle
Subject: Re: This is why I don't trust Obama
"John_Brian_K"

>> What?
>
> I was picking out a few new colors on Recgroups to make certain people
> appear with different colors. I made you green for a pickle, but I wanted
> to make your impostor a completely rotten pickle type color.
>
> It seemed to fit.

I meant "what?"

Like "What color?"

What color did you pick for the capital i pickle rather than the small el
pickle?




        
Date: 05 Feb 2009 06:30:51
From: John_Brian_K
Subject: Re: This is why I don't trust Obama
> What color did you pick for the capital i pickle rather than the small el
> pickle?

I still have not decided.

==========================================
You must not think me necessarily foolish because I am facetious,
nor will I consider you necessarily wise because you are grave.
==============================
47.5% of all statistics are made up on the spot.
JBK

_____________________________________________________________________ 
RecGroups : the community-oriented newsreader : www.recgroups.com




    
Date: 04 Feb 2009 12:06:02
From: Kyle T. Jones
Subject: Re: This is why I don't trust Obama
da pickle, my dear, dear friend, there was this time, oh, 2/4/2009 10:49
AM or thereabouts, when you let the following craziness loose on Usenet:
And when those on RGP continue with the "messiah" complex, Mike
> is "right" (correct) in continuing with his repetition ... but it is still
> not funny.
>

Quick Pickler challenge - name just one of "those on RGP (who) continue
with the "messiah" complex".

Or is it that you're going to claim anyone here who either voted for
Obama or considers him an improvement over the former administration is
guilty of this "messiah" complex?

I have yet to see anyone here engage in the kind of "Obama! will! save!
us! from! everything!" commentary that you and Irish apparently think is
so common.

Cheers.


     
Date: 04 Feb 2009 18:20:31
From: da pickle
Subject: Re: This is why I don't trust Obama
"Kyle T. Jones"

> I have yet to see anyone here engage in the kind of "Obama! will! save!
> us! from! everything!" commentary that you and Irish apparently think is
> so common.

Wow. Even half right is not enough.

The point of the "All in the Family" comparison is that both sides (did I
not make that clear) are often half right and half wrong. It is the
inability to see both sides that makes those at the extreme so funny or
unfunny as you might see it.

I don't think you have a messiah complex, trout. I think Mike is a little
over the top in his presentations. You apparently do not think ... say
Orange ... or maybe Rudy ... are just a tad over the top in theirs?

Perception is reality, I suppose.




      
Date: 05 Feb 2009 09:09:39
From: Kyle T. Jones
Subject: Re: This is why I don't trust Obama
da pickle, my dear, dear friend, there was this time, oh, 2/4/2009 6:20
PM or thereabouts, when you let the following craziness loose on Usenet:
> "Kyle T. Jones"
>
>> I have yet to see anyone here engage in the kind of "Obama! will! save!
>> us! from! everything!" commentary that you and Irish apparently think is
>> so common.
>
> Wow. Even half right is not enough.
>
> The point of the "All in the Family" comparison is that both sides (did I
> not make that clear) are often half right and half wrong. It is the
> inability to see both sides that makes those at the extreme so funny or
> unfunny as you might see it.
>
> I don't think you have a messiah complex, trout. I think Mike is a little
> over the top in his presentations. You apparently do not think ... say
> Orange ... or maybe Rudy ... are just a tad over the top in theirs?

Yes, as I've said directly and implied indirectly a thousand times, I
do. I'm a normal enough dewd, pickle - fairly moderate, I think. My
biggest problem with American Politics is my perception that we have two
parties and neither represents the interests of the majority of us in
the middle-class.

Cheers.

>
> Perception is reality, I suppose.
>
>


       
Date: 05 Feb 2009 11:53:01
From: da pickle
Subject: Re: This is why I don't trust Obama
"Kyle T. Jones"

> Yes, as I've said directly and implied indirectly a thousand times, I do.
> I'm a normal enough dewd, pickle - fairly moderate, I think. My biggest
> problem with American Politics is my perception that we have two parties
> and neither represents the interests of the majority of us in the
> middle-class.

We agree again. Part (a lot?) of the problem might be defining what "us in
the middle-class" might actually mean.

The two party system is supposed to make the extremes of either end of the
two parties less likely to gain any real control of the party (or the
government, should that party be in complete control).

It is supposed to be a system that forces both parties to be closer to that
mystical and elusive "middle" than they would be otherwise. That is why
third parties do not do very well ... they are too far some way ... (I do
not like left and right) ... maybe up and down should be used.

There are plenty of "conservative" democrats and plenty of "liberal"
republicans ... often they call themselves moderates ... most politicians
talk a lot but actually, they do not do much.

Problem ... I am very, very "liberal" when it comes to personal freedom
issues ... I am very. very "conservative" when it comes to economic issues
(if one can equate my austrian economics leanings with conservatism) ... we
have neocons to throw in there ... and progressives ... and lots of other
"words" that often do not mean the same things to different people.

There are many people that equate "middle class values" with "christian
values" ... or "family values" ... often quite a bit different than what
some might mean by "san fancisco values" ... even when those bay area folks
are of modest middle class means. Life is a bitch and then you die.




    
Date: 04 Feb 2009 09:35:49
From: JerseyRudy
Subject: Re: This is why I don't trust Obama
On Feb 4 2009 11:49 AM, da pickle wrote:

> <trangers16@hotmail.com> wrote
>
> > Mike makes a pretty good Archie and there are many here that fit the
> > meathead personality. Mike may not be quite as funny but he is often right
> > (in substance) in his very "right" wing rants. Often, those that nit pick
> > his presentation and ignore the half correct observations are being their
> > own variant of meathead.
>
> Wait...if he's half wrong/half right and not funny, doesnt that make
> him Michael Stivic in your analogy above?
> ==============================
>
> Did you miss the "right" wing nut part?
>
>
> And its kind of annoying
> that he uses the "Messiah" tagline and the "thrill ran up my leg"
> shtick. Do people really think this is funny?
> ===============================
>
> It is not funny at all the 100th time. It is still right ... in the sense
> "correct" ... but that is the part that is really not funny any more. BUT,
> it is an example, one of many, about the obsession of the media with the new
> president. And when those on RGP continue with the "messiah" complex, Mike
> is "right" (correct) in continuing with his repetition ... but it is still
> not funny.
>
> Those that ignore the substance (of the message) and attack (make fun of)
> the messenger ... well, they are the unfunny Michael Stivic "meatheads" ...
> but the whole thing is lost when it has to be explained.

It's no surprise that you favored Archie Bunker in those arguments.
Although at least Archie Bunker was proud of his right-wing views, and did
not try to pretend that he was in any way objective...you could learn a
thing or two from Archie in that regard.

_____________________________________________________________________ 
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Date: 04 Feb 2009 18:15:15
From: da pickle
Subject: Re: This is why I don't trust Obama
"JerseyRudy"

>> Those that ignore the substance (of the message) and attack (make fun of)
>> the messenger ... well, they are the unfunny Michael Stivic "meatheads"
>> ...
>> but the whole thing is lost when it has to be explained.
>
> It's no surprise that you favored Archie Bunker in those arguments.
> Although at least Archie Bunker was proud of his right-wing views, and did
> not try to pretend that he was in any way objective...you could learn a
> thing or two from Archie in that regard.

I did not "favor" anything. It was just an observation.

However, now that you enter the fray, you prove the point that was made.




   
Date: 04 Feb 2009 07:41:30
From: brewmaster
Subject: Re: This is why I don't trust Obama
On Feb 4 2009 7:09 AM, trangers16 wrote:

> On Feb 4, 9:02 am, "da pickle" <jcpickels@(nospam)hotmail.com> wrote:
> > "Senator Millionaire"
> >
> > > Irish Mike, why did Bush and the Republicans CREATE the Dept. of
> > > Homeland Security?
> >
> > > What a fucking waste of taxpayer money!!! The FBI should have been
> > > awarded the money! That's their fuckin' job!! Republicans and smaller
> > > government is a crock of fuckin' shit!
> >
> > Seems like a good rant to me.  But where is the "other side?"
> >
> > It can be worse.
> >
> > I heard a good analogy the other day ... someone was watching old reruns of
> > All in the Family and identifying Archie Bunker as half right and half
wrong
> > on his rants but always funny ... and Michael Stivic as half right and half
> > wrong on his rants but always a total and complete non-funny and annoying
> > ... well ... meathead.
> >
> > Mike makes a pretty good Archie and there are many here that fit the
> > meathead personality.  Mike may not be quite as funny but he is often right
> > (in substance) in his very "right" wing rants.  Often, those that nit pick
> > his presentation and ignore the half correct observations are being their
> > own variant of meathead.
>
> Wait...if he's half wrong/half right and not funny, doesnt that make
> him Michael Stivic in your analogy above? And its kind of annoying
> that he uses the "Messiah" tagline and the "thrill ran up my leg"
> shtick. Do people really think this is funny?

You know that the "thrill ran up my leg" came directly from the mouth of
Chris Matthews, right?


Brew
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Date: 04 Feb 2009 06:39:24
From: Senator Millionaire
Subject: Re: This is why I don't trust Obama
Irish Mike, why did Bush and the Republicans CREATE the Dept. of
Homeland Security?

What a fucking waste of taxpayer money!!! The FBI should have been
awarded the money! That's their fuckin' job!! Republicans and smaller
government is a crock of fuckin' shit!


   
Date: 04 Feb 2009 10:27:43
From: ChrisRobin
Subject: Re: This is why I don't trust Obama
On Feb 4 2009 9:39 AM, Senator Millionaire wrote:

> Irish Mike, why did Bush and the Republicans CREATE the Dept. of
> Homeland Security?

It's an instrument that was created to control local (non-federal) law
enforcement.

> What a fucking waste of taxpayer money!!! The FBI should have been
> awarded the money! That's their fuckin' job!! Republicans and smaller
> government is a crock of fuckin' shit!

Indeed. The bigger the lie...

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Date: 04 Feb 2009 08:17:22
From: John_Brian_K
Subject: Re: This is why I don't trust Obama
> Irish Mike, why did Bush and the Republicans CREATE the Dept. of
> Homeland Security?
>
> What a fucking waste of taxpayer money!!! The FBI should have been
> awarded the money! That's their fuckin' job!! Republicans and smaller
> government is a crock of fuckin' shit!

A better question is how come the amounts that are spent on it were not
listed in the USAspending.com website?

There were only 3 agencies that did not report a dollar figure: Homeland
Security, Nuclear Regulatory Commission and Office of Personnel management.

==========================================
You must not think me necessarily foolish because I am facetious,
nor will I consider you necessarily wise because you are grave.
==============================
47.5% of all statistics are made up on the spot.
JBK

______________________________________________________________________ 
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Date: 04 Feb 2009 09:02:13
From: da pickle
Subject: Re: This is why I don't trust Obama
"Senator Millionaire"

> Irish Mike, why did Bush and the Republicans CREATE the Dept. of
> Homeland Security?
>
> What a fucking waste of taxpayer money!!! The FBI should have been
> awarded the money! That's their fuckin' job!! Republicans and smaller
> government is a crock of fuckin' shit!

Seems like a good rant to me. But where is the "other side?"

It can be worse.

I heard a good analogy the other day ... someone was watching old reruns of
All in the Family and identifying Archie Bunker as half right and half wrong
on his rants but always funny ... and Michael Stivic as half right and half
wrong on his rants but always a total and complete non-funny and annoying
... well ... meathead.

Mike makes a pretty good Archie and there are many here that fit the
meathead personality. Mike may not be quite as funny but he is often right
(in substance) in his very "right" wing rants. Often, those that nit pick
his presentation and ignore the half correct observations are being their
own variant of meathead.




    
Date: 04 Feb 2009 11:19:30
From: Irish Mike
Subject: Re: This is why I don't trust Obama

"da pickle" <jcpickels@(nospam)hotmail.com > wrote in message
news:EPidnSShErFmMBTU4p2dnAA@giganews.com...
> "Senator Millionaire"
>
>> Irish Mike, why did Bush and the Republicans CREATE the Dept. of
>> Homeland Security?
>>
>> What a fucking waste of taxpayer money!!! The FBI should have been
>> awarded the money! That's their fuckin' job!! Republicans and smaller
>> government is a crock of fuckin' shit!
>
> Seems like a good rant to me. But where is the "other side?"
>
> It can be worse.
>
> I heard a good analogy the other day ... someone was watching old reruns
> of All in the Family and identifying Archie Bunker as half right and half
> wrong on his rants but always funny ... and Michael Stivic as half right
> and half wrong on his rants but always a total and complete non-funny and
> annoying ... well ... meathead.
>
> Mike makes a pretty good Archie and there are many here that fit the
> meathead personality. Mike may not be quite as funny but he is often
> right (in substance) in his very "right" wing rants. Often, those that
> nit pick his presentation and ignore the half correct observations are
> being their own variant of meathead.

I never make a political post that I don't believe is insightful, accurate
and truthful. The day no one on RGP argues with me about them is the day
I.Q.s rise 50 points and some one shoots all the left wing liberals,
atheists and pro-murder abortionists dead.

Irish Mike

Irish Mikesome of the people on RGP stop arguing with me is the day I.Qs
rose sharpely
>
>




  
Date: 03 Feb 2009 21:38:46
From: CheckRazor
Subject: Re: This is why I don't trust Obama
>
> More than 50% of Americans agree with IM on the stimulus package, and
> Obama's ratings are already slipping because of it. =A0I think he is maki=
ng
> an early mistake with this one, and he should make some sort of effort to
> listen to some of the criticism and change the package.


Can youi provide a link with that fairy tale?


   
Date: 04 Feb 2009 06:18:58
From: Susan
Subject: Re: This is why I don't trust Obama

"CheckRazor" <Luv2skibumps_222@hotmail.com > wrote in message
news:1825329d-e776-458b-b71e-ced0204f4222@l33g2000pri.googlegroups.com...
>
> More than 50% of Americans agree with IM on the stimulus package, and
> Obama's ratings are already slipping because of it. I think he is making
> an early mistake with this one, and he should make some sort of effort to
> listen to some of the criticism and change the package.


>Can youi provide a link with that fairy tale?

http://www.gallup.com/poll/114097/Americans-Support-Stimulus-Major-Changes.aspx




   
Date: 04 Feb 2009 03:29:06
From: Will_gamble
Subject: Re: This is why I don't trust Obama
On Feb 3 2009 11:38 PM, CheckRazor wrote:

>
> Can youi provide a link with that fairy tale?

Do you believe the proposed stimulus package should be passed as currently
written? If so, why?

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Date: 04 Feb 2009 06:07:26
From: Susan
Subject: Re: This is why I don't trust Obama
Here's another fairy tale.

Democrat: Obama Team 'Encouraged' Defiance of Pelosi on Stimulus

http://www.foxnews.com/story/0,2933,487632,00.html

http://www.weeklystandard.com/weblogs/TWSFP/2009/02/obama_vs_pelosi.asp



"Will_gamble" <a1794@webnntp.invalid > wrote in message
news:2pao56xd82.ln2@recgroups.com...
> On Feb 3 2009 11:38 PM, CheckRazor wrote:
>
>>
>> Can youi provide a link with that fairy tale?
>
> Do you believe the proposed stimulus package should be passed as currently
> written? If so, why?
>
> _______________________________________________________________________
> * kill-files, watch-lists, favorites, and more.. www.recgroups.com
>




  
Date: 03 Feb 2009 21:27:46
From: brewmaster
Subject: Re: This is why I don't trust Obama
On Feb 3 2009 9:05 PM, Porsche_Dan wrote:

> Name one Politician that you trust?
>
> GWB? McCain? How about your messiah RushL?
>
> Name one Politician that you would trust with your pension, 401k, or
> whatever life line you have.
>
> So when you say you don't trust Obama why should anybody give a rats ass?
>
> I happen to agree with you on the stimulus package but your phraseology is
> ignorant.

More than 50% of Americans agree with IM on the stimulus package, and
Obama's ratings are already slipping because of it. I think he is making
an early mistake with this one, and he should make some sort of effort to
listen to some of the criticism and change the package.

>
>
>
>
>
>
>
> On Feb 3 2009 8:10 PM, Irish Mike wrote:
>
> > Some RGPers say I "hate" Obama. That's not true. I do not hate Obama, I
> > just don't trust him. And the $ 885 billion ($ one trillion plus with
> > interest) "stimulus" bill he and the Democrats are trying to shove down
the
> > tax payer's throats is one of the reasons. America is in financial crisis
> > and we desperately need some thing to turn this economy around and get us
> > back on track. Forgetting all disagreements on what really caused the
> > financial mess, this is the time to put partisan politics and social
> > engineering aside and really do some thing to help the American people.
> > What do the Democrats do? They jam a disgraceful $ 885 billion pork
barrel
> > spending bill through congress that contains every ear mark and pet
spending
> > project they can think of. Less than 25% of it will go toward job
creation
> > and most of it won't even reach the economy for two or three years. To
> > their credit, all 177 congressional Republicans and 11 Democrats voted
> > against it. So now this $ 885 billion welfare, entitlement and grow big
> > federal government spending monstrosity slithers in to the Senate.
> >
> > Senate Republicans stripped out the pork barrel spending and created an
> > alternative economic stimulus program that will jump start the economy,
> > create new jobs and do it for $445 billion, which is half the cost of the
> > Democrat plan.
> >
> > "WASHINGTON (Reuters) - U.S. Senate Republicans on Tuesday offered their
> > own, cheaper economic stimulus plans focused on tax cuts, pushing back
> > against a nearly $900 billion Democratic plan they say encourages too much
> > new spending.
> >
> > "The American people are beginning to figure out what this package is,
that
> > it's not a stimulus package -- it's a spending package," said Sen. John
> > McCain, an Arizona Republican who lost to Obama in the 2008 presidential
> > election.
> >
> > Senators worked throughout the day to find a bipartisan deal. McCain and
> > four other Republicans unveiled their ideas priced at $445 billion, half
the
> > cost of Democratic version which started the day at $885 billion.
> >
> > It centered on cutting in half a 6.2 percent payroll tax on employees,
> > cutting the corporate tax rate to 25 percent from 35 percent and lowering
> > the bottom two income tax brackets to 10 percent and 5 percent, all for
one
> > year.
> >
> > McCain and Sens. Lindsey Graham of South Carolina, John Thune of South
> > Dakota, Richard Burr of North Carolina and Mel Martinez of Florida also
> > proposed $11 billion to help prevent home foreclosures and $65 billion in
> > state grants to build and repair bridges and roads."
> >
> > Now the following are some examples of the non-job creating, non-economic
> > stimulus spending that is included in the Democrat's $885 billion bill.
> > Keep in mind that the purpose of the bill is to be a temporary, targeted
> > stimulus to immediately create jobs and jump start the economy. It was
not
> > supposed to be loaded with welfare, entitlement, give away and social
> > engineering spending. There are already multiple government agencies and
> > spending bills to address those issues.
> >
> > "(CNN) -- On Monday, Congressional Republican leaders put out a list of
what
> > they call wasteful provisions in the Senate version of the nearly $900
> > billion stimulus bill that is being debated:
> >
> > $2 billion earmark to re-start FutureGen, a near-zero emissions coal
power
> > plant in Illinois that the Department of Energy defunded last year because
> > it said the project was inefficient.
> >
> > .. A $246 million tax break for Hollywood movie producers to buy motion
> > picture film.
> >
> > .. $650 million for the digital television converter box coupon program.
> >
> > .. $88 million for the Coast Guard to design a new polar icebreaker
(arctic
> > ship).
> >
> > .. $448 million for constructing the Department of Homeland Security
> > headquarters.
> >
> > .. $248 million for furniture at the new Homeland Security headquarters.
> >
> > .. $600 million to buy hybrid vehicles for federal employees.
> >
> > .. $400 million for the Centers for Disease Control to screen and prevent
> > STD's.
> >
> > .. $1.4 billion for rural waste disposal programs.
> >
> > .. $125 million for the Washington sewer system.
> >
> > .. $150 million for Smithsonian museum facilities.
> >
> > .. $1 billion for the 2010 Census, which has a projected cost overrun of
$3
> > billion.
> >
> > .. $75 million for "smoking cessation activities."
> >
> > .. $200 million for public computer centers at community colleges.
> >
> > .. $75 million for salaries of employees at the FBI.
> >
> > .. $25 million for tribal alcohol and substance abuse reduction.
> >
> > .. $500 million for flood reduction projects on the Mississippi River.
> >
> > .. $10 million to inspect canals in urban areas.
> >
> > .. $6 billion to turn federal buildings into "green" buildings.
> >
> > .. $500 million for state and local fire stations.
> >
> > .. $650 million for wildland fire management on forest service lands.
> >
> > .. $1.2 billion for "youth activities," including youth summer job
programs.
> >
> > .. $88 million for renovating the headquarters of the Public Health
Service.
> >
> > .. $412 million for CDC buildings and property.
> >
> > .. $500 million for building and repairing National Institutes of Health
> > facilities in Bethesda, Maryland.
> >
> > .. $160 million for "paid volunteers" at the Corporation for National and
> > Community Service.
> >
> > .. $5.5 million for "energy efficiency initiatives" at the Department of
> > Veterans Affairs National Cemetery Administration.
> >
> > .. $850 million for Amtrak.
> >
> > .. $100 million for reducing the hazard of lead-based paint.
> >
> > .. $75 million to construct a "security training" facility for State
> > Department Security officers when they can be trained at existing
facilities
> > of other agencies.
> >
> > .. $110 million to the Farm Service Agency to upgrade computer systems.
> >
> > .. $200 million in funding for the lease of alternative energy vehicles
for
> > use on military installations. "
> >
> >
> >
> > And that list doesn't even include the $400 million for global warming
> > research or the tens of millions that will go to ACORN, which is currently
> > charged with voter fraud in 13 states. As I said, I don't hate Obama, I
> > just don't trust him.
> >
> > Irish Mike


Brew
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Date: 03 Feb 2009 22:18:22
From: mccard
Subject: Re: This is why I don't trust Obama

"Irish Mike" <mjostar@ameritech.net > wrote in message
news:0E8il.10181$pr6.8011@flpi149.ffdc.sbc.com...

Well I think we are all shocked at the revelation that IM doesn't trust the
POTUS.



  
Date: 03 Feb 2009 23:46:21
From: henri
Subject: Re: This is why I don't trust Obama
On Tue, 3 Feb 2009 22:18:22 -0600, "mccard" <no_won@no_won.none >
wrote:

>Well I think we are all shocked at the revelation that IM doesn't trust the
>POTUS.

Funny how that was considered treason when POTUS was a Repig Nazi. Now
it is obligatory if you are a right wing fascist to hate America and
hate the President.


   
Date: 04 Feb 2009 00:00:22
From: Irish Mike
Subject: Re: This is why I don't trust Obama

"henri" <henri@nowhere.invalid > wrote in message
news:sb7io4plj2s4alum1qf4malms0ava1ha9v@4ax.com...
> On Tue, 3 Feb 2009 22:18:22 -0600, "mccard" <no_won@no_won.none>
> wrote:
>
>>Well I think we are all shocked at the revelation that IM doesn't trust
>>the
>>POTUS.
>
> Funny how that was considered treason when POTUS was a Repig Nazi. Now
> it is obligatory if you are a right wing fascist to hate America and
> hate the President.

Translated from liberalesse: You made a lot of good points I don't like and
provided a lot of facts that I can't refute. So I'm going to ignore the
issues and facts and just call you a right wing Nazi. Pretty pathetic
bucko.

Irish Mike




  
Date: 03 Feb 2009 21:24:42
From: CheckRazor
Subject: Re: This is why I don't trust Obama
On Feb 3, 9:57=A0pm, "Irish Mike" <mjos...@ameritech.net > wrote:
>>
> Jesus wept! =A0Do you liberals know any thing except the same old class
> warfare bull shit you've been regurgitating for the last forty years? =A0=
Tax
> cuts help businesses, corporations and all working Americans. =A0They cre=
ate
> more jobs and they stimulate the economy because working people get to ke=
ep
> more of the money they earn. =A0News flash numb nuts - spending $885 bill=
ion
> to grow the federal government isn't going to create jobs or help working
> class people.
>
> Irish Mike

>>>You Goddamn right, Irish Mike! More tax cuts for the wealthy!
This program has worked so wonderfully for the last eight years!
Youbetcha!
Sara Palin 2012!
Youbetcha!


   
Date: 04 Feb 2009 07:42:35
From: brewmaster
Subject: Re: This is why I don't trust Obama
On Feb 3 2009 9:24 PM, CheckRazor wrote:

> On Feb 3, 9:57 pm, "Irish Mike" <mjos...@ameritech.net> wrote:
> >>
> > Jesus wept!  Do you liberals know any thing except the same old class
> > warfare bull shit you've been regurgitating for the last forty years?  Tax
> > cuts help businesses, corporations and all working Americans.  They create
> > more jobs and they stimulate the economy because working people get to keep
> > more of the money they earn.  News flash numb nuts - spending $885 billion
> > to grow the federal government isn't going to create jobs or help working
> > class people.
> >
> > Irish Mike
>
> >>>You Goddamn right, Irish Mike! More tax cuts for the wealthy!
> This program has worked so wonderfully for the last eight years!
> Youbetcha!
> Sara Palin 2012!

Cheney-Rove '12 - for a better America!

> Youbetcha!


Brew
--
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Date: 03 Feb 2009 20:37:58
From: CheckRazor
Subject: Re: This is why I don't trust Obama
I'm with Irish Mike, I think only the way out of this mess is more tax
cuts for the super-wealthy one percent. And if that doesn't work,
we'll give them rebates, dammit.

I'm not sure if we really need a middle clas any more. After all, we
do have Mexicans to clean things up, right?

And we still have the Jesus freaks who blindly follow their Messiah,
Rush Limbaugh.

And after all the jobs dry up, the Jesus freaks can start doing the
Mexican's jobs.

You're right, Irish Mike, no action is better than action.


   
Date: 03 Feb 2009 20:58:55
From: gtech1
Subject: Re: This is why I don't trust Obama
lowering
the bottom two income tax brackets to 10 percent and 5 percent, all for
one
year.

On Feb 3 2009 11:37 PM, CheckRazor wrote:

> I'm with Irish Mike, I think only the way out of this mess is more tax
> cuts for the super-wealthy one percent. And if that doesn't work,
> we'll give them rebates, dammit.
>
> I'm not sure if we really need a middle clas any more. After all, we
> do have Mexicans to clean things up, right?
>
> And we still have the Jesus freaks who blindly follow their Messiah,
> Rush Limbaugh.
>
> And after all the jobs dry up, the Jesus freaks can start doing the
> Mexican's jobs.
>
> You're right, Irish Mike, no action is better than action.

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Date: 03 Feb 2009 23:57:17
From: Irish Mike
Subject: Re: This is why I don't trust Obama

"CheckRazor" <Luv2skibumps_222@hotmail.com > wrote in message
news:7d60bb43-7573-4c80-b2eb-be861300219b@w39g2000prb.googlegroups.com...
> I'm with Irish Mike, I think only the way out of this mess is more tax
> cuts for the super-wealthy one percent. And if that doesn't work,
> we'll give them rebates, dammit.

Jesus wept! Do you liberals know any thing except the same old class
warfare bull shit you've been regurgitating for the last forty years? Tax
cuts help businesses, corporations and all working Americans. They create
more jobs and they stimulate the economy because working people get to keep
more of the money they earn. News flash numb nuts - spending $885 billion
to grow the federal government isn't going to create jobs or help working
class people.

Irish Mike




    
Date: 04 Feb 2009 10:53:34
From: hap
Subject: Re: This is why I don't trust Obama
On Tue, 3 Feb 2009 23:57:17 -0500, "Irish Mike"
<mjostar@ameritech.net > wrote:

>
>"CheckRazor" <Luv2skibumps_222@hotmail.com> wrote in message
>news:7d60bb43-7573-4c80-b2eb-be861300219b@w39g2000prb.googlegroups.com...
>> I'm with Irish Mike, I think only the way out of this mess is more tax
>> cuts for the super-wealthy one percent. And if that doesn't work,
>> we'll give them rebates, dammit.
>
>Jesus wept! Do you liberals know any thing except the same old class
>warfare bull shit you've been regurgitating for the last forty years? Tax
>cuts help businesses, corporations and all working Americans. They create
>more jobs and they stimulate the economy because working people get to keep
>more of the money they earn. News flash numb nuts - spending $885 billion
>to grow the federal government isn't going to create jobs or help working
>class people.
>
>Irish Mike
>

So you're saying do more of what's been done for the last 8 years and
what got us to where we are now.

Uhhh... No.


    
Date: 04 Feb 2009 00:00:22
From: MZB
Subject: Re: This is why I don't trust Obama
Actually I think Jesus wept because she is fucking sick of your lengthy
daily moronic parroted diatribes.

Mel
"Irish Mike" <mjostar@ameritech.net > wrote in message
news:Pe9il.3604$PE4.1457@nlpi061.nbdc.sbc.com...
>
> "CheckRazor" <Luv2skibumps_222@hotmail.com> wrote in message
> news:7d60bb43-7573-4c80-b2eb-be861300219b@w39g2000prb.googlegroups.com...
>> I'm with Irish Mike, I think only the way out of this mess is more tax
>> cuts for the super-wealthy one percent. And if that doesn't work,
>> we'll give them rebates, dammit.
>
> Jesus wept! Do you liberals know any thing except the same old class
> warfare bull shit you've been regurgitating for the last forty years? Tax
> cuts help businesses, corporations and all working Americans. They create
> more jobs and they stimulate the economy because working people get to
> keep more of the money they earn. News flash numb nuts - spending $885
> billion to grow the federal government isn't going to create jobs or help
> working class people.
>
> Irish Mike
>
>